Because one could be construed as fantasy and the other as sleazy.
I do not find bad language jarring in writing, indeed it is essential for some writing. Sex has to be handled well in writing, the author needs to know to what end it is for; the sensual, the violent, titillating etc. I have no problem with sex scenes, but I don't like that particular sentance. It isn't the use of 'cunt', it is the way that in my mind the woman is a passive creature having things done to her that physically and emotionally render her helpless. I don't like it. I do happen to like your writing though, I read Tight like That and thought it was excellent. I should have done a free will review actually.

Um, isn't the woman having her skull caved in with a broadsword just as passive and helpless?


We do regulate sex more than violence and I do find that a little absurd, not to mention misanthropic. My guess is it's the squirm factor explaining it all. Welshwonder like most of us has been largely desensitized to depictions of violence but not sex, so it's only sex being objected to here, a rationalization at bottom.

I must confess that i'm pretty indifferent to both sentences (although i like the violent one better ). I guess sex scenes getting a battering is partly because sex has pretty much always been seen as disgusting by society (perhaps started in the Bible, like so many taboos?). I suppose with violence the shock-horror factor wore off (for our ancestors at least) because they had to kill stuff on a daily basis or saw stuff being killed.

Today it's more down personal taste, i would think.

Just me thoughts on it.

I think it is obvious, really, don't you? It is all personal preference. I have read some sex scenes expertly written and I have read some that are totally awkward and awful (when that is not what the writer was aiming for).
I guess I concede that our sensibilities are more in tun with reading about people having thir heads caved in, however, this is not the type of book I go for actually. The books I go for are more likely to have sex scenes in then, I just didnt like that sentance.

I think both sentences could be seen as equally objectionable, because they appear 'violent' or aggressive in tone. The sex scene is not offensive in itself (and the bible does not refer to sex as 'disgusting') but the use of language is the issue. Yes, at the end of the day they are only words - this we know - but all words have cultural meanings attached to them. Lawrence is fully aware of this I'm sure - he has deliberately used provocative language to start the debate. These words are loaded with meaning, as are all words. Which is why, as writers, we spend so much time agonising over them! 'A person is a fool to become a writer. His only compensation is absolute freedom.' Roald Dahl

I suspect the first sentence would be rated a 15 and the second an 18 by our good friends who do classications.

Having just seen the excellent, but extremely gratuitous 'No Country for Old Men' I feel qualified to say so.

No doubt an exposed nipple might have pushed it over the cravasse and made it an 18.

I didn't find the language used in either sentence offensive. I guess I'm desensitised. I didn't like the theme of either though, but for different reasons, both personal I guess.

I don't enjoy reading about violence because I get exposed to so much of it whenever I turn the news on with reports from warzones, bomb sites, murder scenes, etc. So I personally wouldn't choose to read a violent book for pleasure although I would of course support a writer's belief that the story they are telling needs to show violence. I certainly wouldn't mark anyone down on here for using fictional violence, as long as they wrote it well.

I do enjoy reading about sex if it's well written as part of a story where I'm totally involved with the characters. Reading Lawrence's second sentence stand alone from its story I don't know who these people are, I don't care about them and so I feel like a voyeur on what is a private scene. And yes, I know that works for some people, but I guess I'm a romantic! I'm not disgusted, I just didn't really want to know. But if I cared about these people, if I was glad that he was making her happy, or sad, or that he was having a nice time himself – then I'd probably like it.

Maybe it's something around violence being a matter in the public interest while sex is considered private that means people confuse the theme with the language when they find the use of sexual 'swear' words is offensive? We live in a horrible world, surrounded by violence (not many broadswords these days, admittedly) but most of us don't talk in biologically accurate detail about our sex lives in public and don't expect to hear in so much detail about anyone else's. It's not just personal taste, it's the norms of society that fix certain ideas into our minds, like a moral code that violence is bad – we should talk about it, expose it, punish it – while sex between consensual adults is good, but it's private. Not everyone applies the code to the same degree of course but wouldn't life be boring if we were all the same?
K