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A thought about the Top Ten
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HJW
 28 Mar 2006, 17:33 #4673 Reply To Post

Hello admin bods and fellow writers.

I had a thought about the Top Ten...If you look at Toast and Snagglefoot (for example), they have both been in the Top Three for a good proportion of this month. Now, it is possible that even if they are still there on March 31st, come April 1st they could be suddenly knocked out right at the last minute.

My question is this - is it really fair to say that whoever is in the Top 3 on the first of the month should get the crits? Isn't this a bit arbitrary. Would it be fairer to award the crits to whoever has spent the most time in the Top 3 in the previous month?

As I have no chance of getting the crit this month (or ever probably ) whichever method is used, I can claim total impartiality in making this suggestion!

What do others think?

HJW
This post was last edited by HJW, 28 Mar 2006, 17:43
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murrayhurray
 28 Mar 2006, 17:55 #4675 Reply To Post
Hmm .. But what if you entered late through no fault of your own even though you'd been reviewing, waiting, etc.

The other flip side is that a book might have been in the Top Ten most days, but a rating for another book could be considerably higher.

So a premise of the longest period in the top ten could favour those who got in first over those with better feedback and rating .. just a theory ..
The Publisher
 28 Mar 2006, 17:56 #4676 Reply To Post
Quote: HJW, Tuesday, 28 Mar 2006 17:33


I had a thought about the Top Ten...If you look at Toast and Snagglefoot (for example), they have both been in the Top Three for a good proportion of this month. Now, it is possible that even if they are still there on March 31st, come April 1st they could be suddenly knocked out right at the last minute.

My question is this - is it really fair to say that whoever is in the Top 3 on the first of the month should get the crits? Isn't this a bit arbitrary. Would it be fairer to award the crits to whoever has spent the most time in the Top 3 in the previous month?

HJW


I think that's a point well made. I'm pretty sure though that I've read in other threads that "they who must be obeyed" are already planning to extend crits and (doubtless) cherished places on the best-seller list to cover just this eventuality.

Right now that's probably fairest as it's always bad to change the rules mid-competition, but I agree it would be a shame for Toast (must read it) and Snagglefoot (already have) to miss out now.
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HJW
 28 Mar 2006, 19:38 #4680 Reply To Post
Quote: murrayhurray, Tuesday, 28 Mar 2006 17:55
Hmm .. But what if you entered late through no fault of your own even though you'd been reviewing, waiting, etc.

The other flip side is that a book might have been in the Top Ten most days, but a rating for another book could be considerably higher.

So a premise of the longest period in the top ten could favour those who got in first over those with better feedback and rating .. just a theory ..


Yes, but then if those chapters stayed in the top three for long enough the following month...

I dunno, it was just something that occured to me while I was writing something very dull at work...
This post was last edited by HJW, 28 Mar 2006, 19:39
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Kestanan
 28 Mar 2006, 20:40 #4686 Reply To Post
HJW, that would still mean that storys that have been around longer will do better purely doe to longevity, after all, they are unlikly to drop their rating much are they? Plus it encourages the more competative minded to keep their stuff up and credited rather than going ahead with a rewrite.

Any ranking system inevitably brings out the competitor in people, which in turn leads to the concern being rank rather than improving. Trust me on this one, if theres an exploitable loophole, someone will exploit it.

K.
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HJW
 28 Mar 2006, 20:54 #4688 Reply To Post
Quote: Kestanan, Tuesday, 28 Mar 2006 20:40
HJW, that would still mean that storys that have been around longer will do better purely doe to longevity, after all, they are unlikly to drop their rating much are they?

K.


Not always true K. Often something will be highly rated after say 5 or 6 reviews, then will drop a few points with subsequent reviews.

But you are right - any ratings system will have loopholes...

HJW
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YouWriteOn
 28 Mar 2006, 21:25 #4689 Reply To Post
Hello All

It's a fine balance. The Top Ten is about accessibility as well. Many members get reviews very quickly. Some don't have as much time as others and toting up 5 reviews can take longer. The function whereby those with longevity in the Top Ten will go the Best Sellers Chart, even if they never reach the Top Three, will help to recognise more writers. The Best Sellers Chart will look at a more sustained level of reviews.

As mentioned in the thread below, part of the Best Sellers Chart aim will be that the good writing of one book benefits another e.g. if someone likes one set of chapters, it aims to encourage them to peruse others. We see many constructive reviews and the aim is to encourage a constructive culture which sees that this is the best way forward. Not to get too Zen, but perhaps a simple analogy in terms of how it is best to see fellow writers as collaborators rather than competitors, would be to imagine someone going into a bookshop and seeing one author has deliberate put a lot of shoddy books around his own in order to highlight himself as the best one. More likely what would happen is the browser would chance on one of the many bad books and not get to the good one, not come back. Whereas if the shelves are stacked with good books, the browser is more likely to peruse others and return. The analogy applies to what constructive reviewing can help to achieve for everyone’s writing. The next development stage will be taking place over the coming weeks to help achieve this.

Ted

http://www.youwriteon.com/forum/YouWriteOn--The-Charts-Topic-981-1.aspx
YouWriteOn
 28 Mar 2006, 21:34 #4691 Reply To Post
It's also swings and roundabouts, as Kestanan mentions, and HJW discusses, we are tending to see a lot of rewrites when members chapters hit a certain level, and the members who then do rewrites to counteract are tending to do much better. So while any score levelling out may be seen as a negative point, it can also be a real positive. On a practical note, this happened with Bob and James, their rewrites did much better. And, though of course it's not practical to comment during Top Ten proceedings, we could see from the feedback for earlier versions that it would be so much more beneficial for them to rewrite rather than a seemingly 'luckier' approach of making the Top Three before rewriting.

HJW
 28 Mar 2006, 21:43 #4692 Reply To Post
You're always so reasonable Ted!

I like your Zen type analogy.

Thanks for all the good work you admin guys are doing. The site seems to be getting better and better and some of the writing really is top notch.
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YouWriteOn
 29 Mar 2006, 10:37 #4709 Reply To Post
Thanks HJW, you've clocked up 47 days in the Top Ten with The Blue Dress. We'll let members know the amount that automatically sends to the Best Sellers Chart, even if not in the Top Three and gaining a critique, when the next development stage is brought in. You exceed it and will be going there anyway. We're aware of all the issues in and around the charts and the next stage will cover everything, which also means balancing a lot of different issues, including accessibility to the charts re The Top Ten.

All best

Ted
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